Comments on: Rob Myers critique of Open Source https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/ Researching, documenting and promoting peer to peer practices Mon, 13 Oct 2014 12:40:16 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.5.17 By: Another Separation: Distinguishing “Open Source” from Free Software https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-384439 Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:19:29 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-384439 […] http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25 […]

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By: Blogroll » PureDyne a Linux Distro for Artists by Artists https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-327718 Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:31:54 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-327718 […] The book also features an new extended version of ‘Open Source Art again’ by Rob Myers which was reblogged here as ‘Rob Myers critique of Open Source’. […]

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By: P2P Foundation » Blog Archive » PureDyne a Linux Distro for Artists by Artists https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-327705 Wed, 29 Oct 2008 00:03:05 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-327705 […] The book also features an new extended version of ‘Open Source Art again’ by Rob Myers which was reblogged here as ‘Rob Myers critique of Open Source’. […]

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By: Dmytri Kleiner https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-107463 Thu, 30 Aug 2007 21:41:46 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-107463 Eric S. Raymond claims I have it “laughably backwards” because making “Open Source” appealing to Corporations allows “us to co-opt them.” However in the context of sovereign private property rights and unequal distribution of productive assets, scare property (like land and capital) will always capture the wealth generated by labour, including intellectual property. In this sense, neither “Open Source” not “Free Software” has any possibility of “co-opting” the power of gigantic Corporation, to believe we can co-opt them is laughably naive. The reason Open Source is a co-option of Free Software is because by reducing the emphasis on freedom it discourages a broader challenge to property itself, and as I explain in the article cited in my earlier comment, a common-stock of software assets is good for Capital because software is a common input to production. Thus, the corporate world adopted the model, while changing the emphasis to one that suites them more, one without a political message.

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By: Seth Galbraith https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-107029 Tue, 28 Aug 2007 18:38:52 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-107029 I agree that artists should accept all of those bullet points. Artists need consistent systems of principles for free art similar to the Free Software and Open Source systems. If some of these systems are empirical, like Open Source and others are ideological, like Free Software, the movement will only be strengthened. (Artists have always had diverse and even quirky ethics compared to other occupations.)

The Creative Commons approach of giving artists choices ranging from mostly proprietary to copyleft lays a foundation for dialogue on the subject, but is inherently agnostic about the practical or theoretical advantages of choosing copyleft over the other options they provide.

The creators of free art and other cultural works need systems of principles and tools similar to FOSS programmers, but they aren’t exactly the same.

For example: a branch system for Wikipedia might be useful for those big projects which create their own forks of Wikipedia, but the current system is great for individual edits. In a version control or content management system authorities are tasked with choosing which patches to apply and which submissions to accept. In a wiki they only have to decide whether to revert or edit changes that they object to.

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By: Gareth Morgan https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-106829 Mon, 27 Aug 2007 21:34:09 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-106829 I disagree on the gate keeper issue. The brilliant thing about FOSS is that the gatekeepers are only as relevant as the support they can command. Such people often make horrible mistakes or are simply intransigent on points of pride and dogma, on occasion it is entirely necessary to bypass them. In a less liberal system when they make a decision that is it, progress is nearly impossible. I cannot make changes if a particular person has that much direct control. In the FOSS system if work gets rejected I have the option of forking, if I’m wrong then my fork will probably only be relevant to me and will likely die quickly. If the gatekeeper is wrong then he very likely will find himself being in charge of the irrelevant branch. It is Darwinism, when mistakes are made or progress resisted somebody can come along and go over the heads of the intransigents and get things moving forward.

Torvald’s understands this greatly. The Linux kernel has no official mainline, by convention Torvald’s own kernel is considered ‘the kernel’ but there are a whole range of relevant kernels out there and most distros maintain their own branch. Linux development breaks down to a graph where each developer (and hence kernel) is a vertex and each vertex naturally has a narrow range of edges to other trusted developers. When you have this graph, development can go ahead as freely as possible, society will eliminate bad branches and appoint the appropriate person as the de facto leader largely by a Darwinian process (as it stands Linus has done a good job in the past so remains ‘in charge’).

There are countless examples where the current authorities on various projects have simply been wrong and others have taken their work in a different direction to eventually be considered correct. GCC is an obvious project where the original work was entirely displaced by a fork. The meritocracy part isn’t that important, let people get on with things and reality will decide who has merit and who doesn’t.

The largest problem with Wikipedia is that it isn’t a branch scenario. There is one Wikipedia and any idiotic edit is visible to us all. In a branch system each person would have their own Wikipedia with their own articles and then by whatever method the most appropriate branch would be considered mainstream. The current system of experts is at best a fudge, they should have gone further into open sourced methodology. Perhaps a more appropriate system would be a Wiki based around a distributed version control system like Git.

Of course all of this still requires freedom but there is real merit to the bazaar model.

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By: Eric S. Raymond https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-106814 Mon, 27 Aug 2007 19:54:02 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-106814 Your analysis of the intentions of “open source” is not quite correct. It is true that the term “open source” was chosen to avoid threatening corporations and mainstream users with scary ideological baggage; however, it is not true that the term is ideologically vacuous, and I never expected that it would be.

Dmytri Kleiner would have us believe that the ideological content is “corporate co-option”, but this is laughably backwards. The “open source” label is not a tool that allows corporations to co-opt us, it is a tool that allows us to co-opt them. Here’s where that rubber meets the road: thousands of developers are now paid to do open-source programming, and even Microsoft (Microsoft!) is now coming to the community asking to participate and requesting license certifications.

The term “open source” has ideological content, all right — it’s all about rational-choice theory and consequentialism, and about what you learn a posteriori from doing the process of open source (as opposed to what you believe a priori theorizing or deontic moralizing about it). The lessons are: if you’re seeking efficiency and production, decentralism wins over centralism, liberty wins over coercion, and peer networks win over hierarchies.

Certainly ideologies, like the “free software” one, can coexist with the implicit ideology of “open source”. But vacuous it isn’t.

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By: Dmytri Kleiner https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/comment-page-1/#comment-106351 Sat, 25 Aug 2007 11:39:14 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/rob-myers-critique-of-open-source/2007/08/25#comment-106351 While I agree with Rob Myers regarding the freedom being an essential component of art and his analysis of open source, this is hardly novel. He points out himself that “freedom of content” is a standard component of art practice dating back to antiquity and his critique of “open source” is the standard position of the Free Software Foundation. Rob is correct in denouncing the “Open Source” movement as a corporate co-option of Free software, in the same way that the Creative Commons is a corporate co-option of Free Culture. However, the real challenge is not to create a list of what artists “should do,” but to face up to the challenge of addressing the socio-economic factors that set the rules on what artists can do, and to identify differences between the production modes of software development and artistic practice that have allowed free software to explode while free culture, despite a much older history than software of any kind, exists only on the margins. I attempt to address some of this in “Copyfarleft, Copyjustright and the Iron Law of Copyright Earnings,” but this is just a beginning, a lot more work and research need to be done in creating the possibility for artists to do what they “should do” and still account for their own material subsistence.

http://www.telekommunisten.net/CopyjustrightCopyfarleft

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