Comments on: Community-Based Co-op Economy vs. the “A-Moral Capital Economy”

By: Sean

Sean — Sun, 12 Jun 2016 16:20:04 +0000

Ideally I agree with you on the cooperative model of creating a balanced economic web of producers and consumers. Ideally.
BUT… we’re human.
And in 10,000+ years… there have always been some humans who have abused, conquered and killed others using the same methods repeatedly (sometimes with updated technologies).

So I do NOT think any ideal balanced economic model is viable for very long UNLESS it has built into it the feedback mechanisms to identify the threats to the system, and eliminate them.

Build an economic system that operates like the human body does to keep itself alive amidst the daily threats made against it, and you might have an economic system that will survive. Copy nature.

The Amoral Capitalism that we’re all so accustomed to… it works as well as it does because its feedback systems are simple… fit-in to help grow or be-gone and die.
(This is my personal biggest problem with this system… is that no natural lifeform survives if it doesn’t have a “maintenance cycle” where there is no expanding growth… just maintaining growth. Although Kudzu might pull it off, if it beat out all other life forms on the planet, it might continue on “happy” as can be.)

I’m not writing an essay here… “cooperative” economic systems won’t survive predators from outside unless there are mechanisms in place to detect and deal with outside threats.

Oh a perfect example… the Internet… it was supposed to be one big happy cooperative where people exchanged information… and yet here too… the predators came… and it has devolved from the happy ideal system of DARPA idealists at the beginning to today’s mass throbbing chaos where idealists are always being attacked by predators of every sort humankind has imagined.

Good luck with your economic model.

By: Sean

Sean — Sun, 12 Jun 2016 16:17:33 +0000

So I do NOT think any ideal balanced economic model is viable for very long UNLESS it has built into it the feedback mechanisms to identify the threats to the system, and eliminate them.

Build an economic system that operates like the human body does to keep itself alive amidst the daily threats made against it, and you might have an economic system that will survive. Copy nature.

The Amoral Capitalism that we’re all so accustomed to… it works as well as it does because its feedback systems are simple… grow or die.
(This is my personal biggest problem with this system… is that no natural lifeform survives if it doesn’t have a “maintenance cycle” where there is no expanding growth… just maintaining growth. Kudzu might pull it off, if it beat out all other life forms on the planet, it might continue on “happy” as can be.)

I’m not writing an essay here… “cooperative” economic systems won’t survive predators from outside unless there are mechanisms in place to detect and deal with outside threats.

Good luck with your economic model.

By: Michel Bauwens

Michel Bauwens — Sun, 13 Dec 2015 12:38:49 +0000

In reply to Chriss. I guess this reply would be useful to anyone advocating a centralized planned economy, but since that article has no relationship to this, I wonder what your point is ? Are you objecting to the fact that more people in the world work for democratic cooperative entreprises than for multinationals ? That tech coops are more successful than startups ?

By: Chriss

Chriss — Sun, 13 Dec 2015 00:44:51 +0000

The “moral” socialist enterprise was and is dysfunctional, bankrupt, poverty producing method. I do not know what sane person would propagandize it!
When people work in a socialist system, the state is the big daddy, creates plans so it’s a top down rigid system with no feed-back. This lack of feed-back, is one of the main reasons why the system is not functional. The govern cannot know how much butter, how many shoes, clothes, gallons of milk the population needs, coupled with no feed-back, creates a lack of many things.
When people work for a government and are paid no matter if they work or not, plus is no competition, the quality of work is poor. Competition is one of the best ways to ensure quality!!!
Because, as Lord Acton said, “power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely”, government with too much power, becomes corrupt, no doubt about that.
Capitalist enterprise which means that people have property, freedom, necessitates rule of law, is not perfect, but it can provide better quality and is far more flexible thus being able to offer what people need!
Bolshevik Russia, Maoist China having this “cooperatist” ideology, experienced dire poverty, famine, deep corruption, silencing of dissidence (of course commies do not like truth), scarcity on all levels, and never progress!
Utopias are nice but you cannot survive them! Life teaches us that it is wise to learn from other people’s mistakes instead of doing huge mistakes repeatedly!
So long commrades,
C