Comments on: Can open source innovate better than corporations? https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/can-open-source-innovate-better-than-corporations/2008/11/18 Researching, documenting and promoting peer to peer practices Sat, 13 Apr 2013 15:25:13 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.5.14 By: Apostolis Xekoukoulotakis https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/can-open-source-innovate-better-than-corporations/2008/11/18/comment-page-1#comment-528351 Sat, 13 Apr 2013 15:25:13 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/?p=2114#comment-528351

Eric Raymond has some good points but his last argument is incorrect. People that do not get paid do not have the burden of corporate control, but how many are able to do that?
Thus Erics last argument is correct in the context of efficiency and not in the context of volume.
The above doc is a report of the linux foundation that remarks that 75% of the code is written by corporations.

The title also seems to be incorrect. All arguments that were put by Eric or Christophe were on the management of the production process, not the license of the code.

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By: Christophe de Dinechin https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/can-open-source-innovate-better-than-corporations/2008/11/18/comment-page-1#comment-340034 Mon, 24 Nov 2008 14:20:22 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/?p=2114#comment-340034 Eric Raymond makes a fool of himself with this post. To begin with, he quotes only a fraction of my “screed”, makes fun of “M’sieu de Dinechin”, and barely avoids calling me a blithering idiot. Said idiot wrote what is arguably the first real 3D game for micro-computer as a student, and later went on to design the enterprise-grade virtual machine monitor of the largest computer corporation in the world today. I’m honored this makes me “reasonably bright” in ESR’s eyes…

Yet for all the name calling, ESR totally misses my point: developers need to eat, and corporations provide vast majority of the necessary funds, even to open-source contributors like ESR or myself. My XL work is all open-source, but I would not have been able to afford it without a regular source of income. That’s my point, and if ESR wrote a single word to address it, I didn’t see it.

As for claiming that open-source build the world-wide-web, sorry Eric, but that’s bollocks and you know it. I could not even find any evidence that Berners-Lee’s browser, WorldWideWeb, was open-source at the time. What everyone knows is that Berners-Lee worked for CERN at the time, in other words he had a stable revenue, and that only reinforces my point. The browser that ignited the web was not Berners-Lee’s (nobody could afford the incredibly expensive and closed-source NeXT machines that ran it) but Mosaic. And as I pointed out in my “screed”, the source code of Mosaic was public, but not open-source by any standard definition. More importantly, it is silly to ignore all the corporate contributions that made the web what it is today, from Netscape to Microsoft to Cisco to fiber-optics to ISPs…

It is legitimate to say that “Tim Berners-Lee invented the world-wide-web”. I think it is even OK to say that hackers built it. But that’s a far cry from “open-source built it”, which seems to be what ESR would want us to believe…

Ultimately, I’d say that Eric’s error number zero is to confuse “ideas” with “innovation”. Innovation is ideas made real.

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By: donald https://blog.p2pfoundation.net/can-open-source-innovate-better-than-corporations/2008/11/18/comment-page-1#comment-336336 Tue, 18 Nov 2008 02:22:09 +0000 http://blog.p2pfoundation.net/?p=2114#comment-336336 quick note:
“There’s an argument commonly heard these days that open-source software is all very well for infrastructure or commodity software where the requirements are well-established, but that it can’t really innovate.”

That line grabbed my attention, because it characterizes the basic argument Levi-Strauss made about bricolage in Third World communities especially. He said that “bricoleurs” were capable of cobbling together different bits of existing technology or even repairing and maintaining existing technologies. They were incapable, however, of truly novel technical innovation, which could only come about within organized industrial society.

I’m startled by the resonance. It sort of reveals something about the world of formal production and what its ideology says about knowledge and the organization of knowledge.

For a conceptual opponent, Deleuze and Guattari’s discussion of “nomad science” offers a wonderful contrasting view, especially with their discussion of the development of gothic architecture in Mille Plateaux.

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